Hi guys,

I've got an issue with a 2862n sat on the end of an ADSL line, it's on the latest firmware and internal network seems to be fine, but the ADSL line has anywhere from 20% to 87% packet loss at the highest, the last 3 days its had 97 RX CRC errors with only 12GB on the WAN in that time. it has high jitter and ping anywhere from 40ms to 110ms on both depending on when the test is run.

The ISP has checked the line from their end and say everything is fine or good even for an ADSL line but I'm convinced there is a problem on the line some where even considering the poor ADSL connection.

The packet loss even stops emails from being sent at times.

I have two questions, is there any one with more ADSL experience that can advise what I can look at to be sure there is a fault on the line for the BT engineer visit to not be a waste of time?

Secondly, there are two ADSL lines into the building, one sits on the ISP's router which just handles the VoIP phones, if I were to load balance these in the Draytek router how well would the phones handle this? I've not had much experience with this type of connection, in a setup like this and I suspect the phones might run in to trouble but again I'm hoping you may have a bit more experience with this and be able to advise. If it were to be reliable I could load balance both connections and have everything running from the Draytek, but I suspect this would not go well.

Finally, from what I can see the router is behaving but could replacing this be worthwhile, as it is now out of support earlier this year?

Thanks for looking

Quick edit, the line stays in sync all the time

Different modems handle lines differently. It all depends and the only way to find out is to experiment.

Openreach will define a working line as within parameters. This means you can have noise (like your CRC errors) and that's still classed as within parameters (that's the term they'll use when dealing with a customer, too). If the line stays in sync, then your isp and Openreach will sée it as within parameters. If it disconnected several times a day, then they'll (attempt to) do something. The reason for all that is that copper attracts all sorts of interference.

You could try to improve things a bit by: installing a better filter (ADSL Nation) and disconnecting tel. extensions; checking equipment at your home for noise (specific times? Specific equipment?); using a different modem code; checking a different router based on a different chipset - from my experience of having a problem line for over a decade, it's a time consuming job and you might never identify the source of noise, as was in my case, despite having guys here from the Chief Engineer Office at Openreach. (Before that we had 20+ engineer visits, plus several from chief engineer office.) They fixed the line to the point that it was usable, but SHINE remained, and so, when a neighbour switched on their equipment, whatever it was, line would disconnect or there would be significant errors.

There are some tell tale signs of problems: visibly fluctuating SNR (for example, from 6db to 1db and back) is indicative of a problem on Openreach's network, such as a problematic joint etc. Errors on the DSL layer (relatively stable SNR) is indicative of interference, such as SHINE and REIN. In my case it was a combination of different factors, and I only have a vague idea of what it was as Openreach keep lip tight that lot most of the time. Even when you do a subject information request through them, which I did, information is scanty and in my case, it was edited, too.

Openreach are an extremely difficult company to deal with, especially when you live in a city. I had two years of fighting with them, two complaints to CEO (you can only complain about an engineer, but not about a service), lots of stress and a lot of resistance from my ISP to do anything, mainly because they had no idea.

But once you pin Openreach and have enough evidence to threaten with court action and press, they are obliging, but still, I've learnt, very crafty in the way they communicate. It was exhausting, as you always have to be on guard and carefully analyse every word they say.

Finally, from my experience, DrayTek routers aren't that great on noisy lines. If all fails in terms of finding an issue, you should try a Fritzbox (7530), which is also Intel based, or Zyxel 8924 (only available on eBay), which also has an internal filter. Using powerline adapters if you have a VDSL connection is a big no, unless you use a good make (devolo) and in combination wit a router that communicates with them well (fritzbox) through the correct protocol.

You also need to remember that since you're dealing with copper, you'll never eliminate errors. Even when I hoovered nearby my router, it'd record some errors.